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301 redirect changed the games

Discussion in 'Black Hat SEO' started by kappa84, Apr 12, 2011.

  1. kappa84

    kappa84 Power Member

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    Hey guys, here's the deal:
    I've been working for more than a year with an UK client in a very very competitive niche with some very competitive keywords. Basically, he was ranking for some major terms on 1-4 spots, all was working great etc.

    In September we and a few other competitors got a penalty (although nothing was mentioned in GWT) we assume for aggressive link building. Went from no1 to no9, from no2 to page 3 and so on, we went way down.

    We continued our work with guest blogging, chose only top-notch sites to build links on, no networks etc.

    Yesterday, something really odd happened: one of our competitors which got the penalty as well did a 301 redirect from his old domain to a new, related one and he regain ALL his rankings (he came back from almost nowhere to way above us).

    Now....I really would need some opinions from those who have tried this "method": is this just the so-called "honeymoon" or he really managed to trick Google and regain his positions after a penalty? :confused:
     
  2. UnDerDoG81

    UnDerDoG81 Regular Member

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    I´am no SEO professional but I also have read that on an german blog. An SEO "guy" tried something. He had an client and his website was sandboxed for a long time. They tried to build agressive links, wrote new content and so on. Nothing helped... Then he tried his last "trick" and redirected the aged domain to an new domain with 301. After 2-3 weeks he was back on #1 spot after a long time in the sandbox...

    The only question I have is, can I copy the exactly backup of my website to an new domain and redirect it to the new one without getting sandboxed for double content?

    How will google know where to point the old deep backlinks on the new domain if I redirect only to the home page? I am ranking for an keyword with competition, only because that deep site has some good backlinks.

    Sorry for my english

    EDIT: No guarantee!
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2011
  3. NLhead38

    NLhead38 Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    I did this as well, it worked but just temporary.. After one week my website had dropped once again. I did a total of 5 redirects, each time with a brand new domain until I got sick of it.
     
  4. kappa84

    kappa84 Power Member

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    So basically I should expect that website to go back down, right?
     
  5. fayans

    fayans Junior Member

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    I second that! I did it as a last resort to pull one of my main sites back into serps (after the Panda thingy) and yes, it worked but googoo was too smart and put me back into the sand and not recovered since.....

    There isn't much you can do about it but what I do now is to send more links to the old domain as if there was no sandbox...... :p
     
  6. UnDerDoG81

    UnDerDoG81 Regular Member

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    Ah ok good to know. Then I dont need to try this...
     
  7. mudbutt

    mudbutt Jr. Executive VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    you should figure out what is triggering the penalty. Google is an algorithm, and something is causing it to flag your site. I had an incident where I added some stuff to my site that is a "no no" to google and within days dropped off the top 500. After removing the content, the site shot right back up again.

    If you really believe its because of the aggressive link building (which I HIGHLY doubt) then the best thing you can do is to continue building links and buy some high PR contextual links. That sounds counter intuitive, but its worked for me over and over again. Thats basically my recipe for rocketlaunching out the "sandbox" and into the #1 position.

    Hope that helps.
     
  8. kappa84

    kappa84 Power Member

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    Mate, the thing is that I am 100% it was because of the link building because we and 2-3 other competitors were fighting for some difficult terms, buying/creating links like mad and boom, all of us got slapped. However, as I told you now have already climbed some places but that is all, no more "up" in the last 2-3 months...

    Nothing was done on-page, only link building...High pr contextual links? We are buying about 3-4/week and not from crap networks but only from high quality websites, paying up to 2-300/post if it worth. However, nothing seems to move...

    And now here comes this competitor with a 301 redirect and regains almost all his positions...That's odd...
     
  9. ivictus

    ivictus Regular Member

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    It sounds like you all have a penalty for your links. Maybe a manual penalty from a spam report, who knows. Any way in this situation I could well imagine the 301 would work. If the algo ranks all the sites then applies the penalty before displaying the SERP. So it ranks all the sites, sees the 301 and puts the new domain in the preliminary results, then applies any penalties to domains on the bad list, then delivers the SERP to the end user.

    Eventually the 301 makes it's way to the bad list and then you have to change to a new domain for your 301 and start all over.
     
  10. coolfx35

    coolfx35 Regular Member

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    my question is when you start a new domain, does it take time to rank it on google? by doing a 301, you basically sending traffic to it. why's the true benefit?
     
  11. kappa84

    kappa84 Power Member

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    coolfx...that guy registered the domain 2 weeks ago, did 301 redirect and now is on no 3 for a keyword with 356,000,000 results and on 3 as well for another one with 110,000,000 results. Say what? :|
     
  12. photoads

    photoads Regular Member

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    I am looking into this too, I did a fair bit of link buying for my sites through footer ads in wordpress themes. Now all was great but now it has gone tits up! Basically there are too many links out there, as they are encrypted I cannot get them changed to no follow. I have minus 30 penalties so pages are on page 6.

    One of the other theme sponsors has just done the 301 redirect to a new domain and he is back ranking. The key he says is to redirect only the pages that were not aggresivley back linked. If you do a full 301 redirect you are just moving the problem with you.
     
  13. kallen

    kallen Regular Member

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    a'ight, I just did the 301 deal. My site was slapped back to page 4/5/6/7 from pages 1/2 on a 3 year old site. I completely rewrote all the content on the site a month after that panda crap and it didn't do a bit of good. The site is an affiliate site but not overly ad driven, its ALOT more legit than most I've seen, had a beautiful custom theme and everything. I believe the slap may have came from interlinking a couple of my sites together that had a few posts that had similar (but mildly re-written) content and that may have made a big footprint. I removed the interlinking 2 weeks ago too, in addition to COMPLETELY rewriting everything, and it didn't help either, so this is the final straw... if this dont work I'm just gonna abandon ship and build a whole new site from scratch. I aint got time to play kung fu with google over this crap when I can rank a brand new site faster than trying t9o play nice! This is BS!

    I'm really not sure what the story is cuz there could be several reasons for the slap, I mean I build alot of profiles, but my other sites do fine with this, I did do a very small scrapebox blast but nothing big (I mean maybe like 10-20 links to each of the inner pages to an auto approve list). I dunno, all I know if thats what did it I cant change that now on this site so whats the point.

    This whole thing has changed my strategy quite a bit tho, and I have found that slow and steady and better quality backlinks (articles etc) do work much better. It is just so hard to throttle things back sometimes, so I had to completely revamp my daily workflow and do everything radically different. I only have one other site I've done this new way and it IS working, just alot more work and hassle, and I guess that's what G is tryin to do and it seems to be workin' I guess.

    This site used to bring in about $1500 a month so its been a pretty big slap for me! I'll report back with my results on this. This is a decent sized site with about 30 pages of content btw, not some 5-10 page micro site, but not a huge monster either.
     
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    Last edited: Jun 2, 2011
  14. dragonrage01

    dragonrage01 Power Member

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    I guess you wrote this in april. If a lot of your competitors are aggressively building links then someone did the easy way out and reported your sites in google spam. It doesn't matter if you do 301 or whatever, you won't get out of it.

    If google algorithm doesn't push you back down then the same guy is going to keep reporting your site. You really have two choices which are wait for the penalty to be lifted or start over from scratch with quality link building.
     
  15. kallen

    kallen Regular Member

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    ok! as promised I'm back and happy to report that my new domain is now 1/2 indexed, and my rankings on about half of those indexed pages are now on page 2 which is at least past the -40 penalty I previously could not shake. Like I said, I did a complete revamp of the site, so its really all new content which I think should shake this penalty. Its still early (only been a couple of days) but this sites been in the penalty box since february, so this is a MAJOR improvement to finally see some forward momentum for the first time in 3-4 months! Hopefully the rest of the site gets picked up over the next few days and the whole thing lasts more than a couple weeks as some people have suggested may happen. I would expect to have lost some rankings with the move because its a pretty competitive niche and I've been too afraid to build many links to it while it was in the penalty box... I'll post a few new things over the next couple weeks, I'm gonna give it a good month to get settled into its new home before I start dripping out dripping out some articles and bookmarks at it and see how she does.
     
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  16. drogon

    drogon Elite Member Premium Member

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    I had a 5 month old domain go from #3 into the sandbox then did a 301 redirect to another domain (6 months old) using the same content and within 2 days was back at no.3 and stayed there so 301 redirect does work. Guess like everything Google, some things will work for some sites but same exact thing will not work for another site.
     
  17. brutang

    brutang Junior Member

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    Thanks for the update, Kallen. Will be watching your progress. I just decided to spend tonight 301'ing some penalized domains to new domains. For one, I even changed the main keyword I was going for with more search volume/lower competition. I was page 1 for about 15 terms (about 28 pages of unique, hand-written content with informative guides and how-tos etc in the beauty niche) which have been slapped back to #70-god knows where early May.

    Interested to see if this helps.
     
  18. UnDerDoG81

    UnDerDoG81 Regular Member

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    I also want to try this! For my keyword there is only left an .biz domain... What do you think, do they rank well?
     
  19. brutang

    brutang Junior Member

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    Don't know how well .biz ranks, but I had a .me domain ranking page 1 for a pretty competitive term for over a year, it's now page 2 after Panda 2. Just check misc serps and see what's ranking well if you're on the fence about TLDs affecting ranking or not and make your own judgment. I just 301'd two domains, one from wordwordword.com to wordwordwordword.com (basically the same keyword with an extra word in there - longer but more search volume and more relevant to the direction I ended up taking the site). The other, word-words.org to free-word-word.com (added free and dropped the s, changed from .org to .com) as it's a site promoting a free product - less competition.

    Both sites have over 20 pages of unique content ranging from 500 to 1000 words all hand-written.

     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2011