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How do you feel about the legalization of marijuana?

Discussion in 'BlackHat Lounge' started by dating101, Nov 14, 2011.

  1. dating101

    dating101 Regular Member

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    Hey all,

    I am doing research for an upcoming debate and the pro and con sides of the medicinal marijuana legalization issue and I could really use your help.

    So, if you could begin each post to this thread with the word "PRO" or "CON" and then the reasoning behind your stance, I would find it as a huge help!

    And also, feel free to engage in argument(s) with other posters (but please keep it civil).

    And also let me know your country (if outside US) and if you are outside of the US, could you let me know if marijuana is legal in your country.

    Thanks a bunch guys (and gals)!!!!!
     
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  2. danizdeman

    danizdeman Regular Member

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    Pros: its better than alcohol... its good for you
    Cons: higher prices, taxes, and normal people using it.
     
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  3. 3Infidels

    3Infidels BANNED BANNED

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    Legalizing it would have many benefits such as:
    1. Less law enforcement costs - both catching people and housing them in prisons

    2. It would help the economy but generating business in many different fields, as well as taxes

    3. It would take away much of the cartels' business, resulting in less violence.

    I think the gubmint should have learned their lesson from the alcohol prohibition. If you take something away from people, they will get it anyway. You are putting business into the hands of criminals.
     
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  4. Codythebest

    Codythebest Senior Member

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    That will reduce its consomation by more than 75%, as it happened in The Netherlands before...
     
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  5. Fuggz

    Fuggz Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    It is very legal here in Colorado, and there have not really been any negative issues.

    I am very much in support of mj legalization, I have a card, am a caregiver and am able to grow 25 plants (anyone want to invest ;) ). Also I have a few close friends that own dispensaries and they do very well for themselves.

    Colorado is a wierd state lately. A lot of people are supporting it instead of CA as most probable to be the first state to fully legalize, and even though there are some battles and gray areas, I have not seen any negative effects locally whatsoever!
     
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  6. Black.Star

    Black.Star Junior Member

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    Cause it´s the fcking nature.
     
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  7. GreyWolf

    GreyWolf Executive VIP Jr. VIP

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    Pro: Legislation should be based on facts not political motivation.

    The sole reason marijuana was prohibited in the first place was to give the government agencies that had been established and expanded from 1919 to 1932 during alcohol prohibition a reason to continue being funded. After alcohol prohibition was ended the agencies charge with enforcing it were facing huge cutbacks. Another substance was needed to justify continued expenditures for those agencies. Do some research on Henry J. Anslinger to find more information about that point.

    Prior to the 1930s cannabis had been an active ingredient in many home remedies and patent medicines. The American Medical Association was much more focused on researching more powerful medicines derived from opiates, but they did accept that cannabis was effective for many common ailments. They didn't consider cannabis a very important or very powerful medicine, but they were also against the legislation to prohibit it. Anslinger pushed his agenda forward anyway and the 1937 Congress approved it in spite of the AMAs opposition.

    In the late 1960s, President Richard M. Nixon commissioned a report to determine how dangerous marijuana really is. After the commission completed the study their conclusion was that marijuana should be regulated rather than prohibited. When the commission presented the report to Nixon he refused to even read it. In spite of the recommendations in a report he himself commissioned, he ignored the findings and proceeded to declare a 'War on Drugs' with marijuana eradication as it's primary focus.

    Since then three other presidents have commissioned similar reports. In each case the conclusion is the same, marijuana should be regulated not prohibited. In each case the conclusions and recommendations of the commissions are ignored and more funding it given to fight the 'War on Drugs'.

    The only groups that benefit from cannabis prohibition and the 'War on Drugs' are the state and federal agencies that receive funding to enforce the laws, and the criminal gangs and organizations that control the black market. In the same way that alcohol prohibition created the market forces that allowed organized crime to establish itself in the 1920's, marijuana prohibition has fueled the continued growth of crime organizations for the last 70 years.

    The Mexican Drug Cartels have become so strong in fact they actually now control key government positions in Mexico. A lot of Americans comment about the corruption in Mexican government, but most don't understand that the U.S. 'War on Drugs' policy has been the biggest factor causing that corruption.

    In the meantime here in the U.S. rather than being infiltrated and corrupted by criminal organizations, our politicians and enforcement agencies have been corrupted by power. In the name of the 'War on Drugs' legislators have created more laws that violate the spirit of the U.S constitution in ways that would have been unthinkable a century ago. One example is asset forfeiture laws. These laws allow the government to seize property in such a way as to deny due process. The property is then sold to raise funds for the enforcement agencies themselves. So not only is due process denied, it effectively creates an unlawful tax which involves a conflict of interest for the agencies charged with enforcing it.

    Today the internet has allowed the public access to a lot more factual information, but the last four generations have been indoctrinated since a young age with the governments anti-marijuana propaganda. Even though it's easy to learn the facts, it's hard to let our early anti-drug beliefs go.

    That's a common propaganda tactic that's been used in the name of the 'War on Drugs'. Marijuana is lumped together with drugs like opium, morphine, heroin, cocaine, methamphetamine, LSD, etc. This effectively creates a situation in peoples minds in which ending the prohibition on marijuana is thought of as legalizing all drugs. That isn't the case, but the propagandists encourage that thought process.

    That propaganda has been so ingrained into our citizens minds makes it easier for the enforcement agencies to continue pushing their self motivated agendas. Since the original Marijuana Tax Act in 1937 effectively established the federal cannabis prohibition, law enforcement agencies have continued to push for more and stronger legislation. Today the DOJ and DEA fight every bill put forth in congress. They've stated publicly that they will fight any efforts to end prohibition.

    Think about that for a minute... Why is are enforcement agencies involving themselves in the legislative process? The legislature is charged with creating these laws, they are supposed to be representing the interests and desires of their constituents. The Justice Department is charged with enforcing those laws and the drug enforcement agencies recieve funding to enforce the laws, so there is a *big* conflict of interest for them to be exerting any influence over the legislation of those laws. So why do we as citizens allow the DOJ to exert such influence over the legislature regarding cannabis prohibition?

    Information provided by numerous medical studies, university research studies, reports commission by presidents and almost all other studies done outside of the DOJs influence conflict with the information provided by the DOJ, DEA, and FDA. Every statement issued by the DOJ, the DEA, and the FDA justifying why marijuana is so dangerous a drug should be looked at with skepticism because those agencies have an agenda not associated with what's in the best interest of U.S. citizens.

    Cannabis should be regulated and legislated on the basis of scientific and medical knowledge, not prohibited for the self-serving interests of agencies who exist at the scale they do as long as prohibition continues.
     
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  8. genesis311

    genesis311 Junior Member

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    I am not for or against the leagilization of marijuana.

    However I think the government should enforce the laws that it has in place.
    so the government needs to decide what to do.
    1 leagilaze marijuana
    OR
    2 enforce the law and arrest everyone who smokes pot.

    Its hard to see the pros of the second option
     
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  9. GreyWolf

    GreyWolf Executive VIP Jr. VIP

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    Option 2 is what the real problem is with prohibition. A total prohibition is an unworkable law.

    They tried it with alcohol and failed. The word 'scofflaw' was created during the 1920s specifically to give name to people who blatantly disregarded the prohibition law. After 70 years of prohibition on marijuana, the U.S. government still refuses to admit that this policy has failed for the same reasons alcohol prohibition failed.

    It isn't so much a matter of legalizing it completely. There still needs to be controls. The legislators just need to create laws to control it rather than prohibit it. While it still causes many problems, alcohol is under much more control than it ever was before prohibition. In fact it's actually under more control than it was even during prohibition. As it turned out regulation was more effective than prohibition.

    Marijuana could be controlled in a similar fashion. Create laws to control how, when, and by whom marijuana can be used and the arrest anyone that violates those laws. All the legislature really needs to do is end the prohibition and replace it with reasonable laws that can be justified based on the facts.

    Right now for the average underage person in the U.S. it's actually easier for them to get marijuana than it is to get alcohol. Just as with alcohol, regulation of marijuana would bring it under more governmental control than it ever has been. If they did that then for the first time the government could factually say they've made progress in winning the 'War on Drugs'.

    16 states have enacted state laws regulating marijuana use. Even Washingon DC, the seat of our federal government, has chosen to regulate rather than prohibit. Yet the federal government responds by threatening the state and county governments over any workable regulation. It's time for the federal government to end prohibition and give control back to the states where it belongs.

    One of the biggest peacetime economic factors that brought the U.S out of the Great Depression was the end of alcohol prohibition. Similarly in our current time ending marijuana prohibition could stop a lot of needless spending on enforcement of the law, and at the same time bring in a lot of much needed tax revenues from regulating it's use and distribution.
     
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  10. poweronics

    poweronics Jr. VIP Jr. VIP Premium Member

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    One of my friend, who is a doctor told that smoking marijuana cause in lowering the blood pressure and slowing heart beat. Further it affect your lungs strongly. Every country have their laws that are made after research and debates. I strongly disagrees of your idea of legalization of marijuana.
     
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    Last edited: Nov 14, 2011
  11. sqhunter

    sqhunter Regular Member

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    I was smoking my brains out between 17-26. Looking back it cost me precious years as it dumbs you down very much and will over time destroy your personal development besides the rest of your life. Just try to smoke every day, then write up a letter and post it..

    Ok, maybe its just my exp, but i am VERY MUCH AGAINS MJ and would recommend getting drunk on weekends instead, at least you wont degenerate into a dumb laughing retard.. among friends staring at a TV and talking shit all day.
     
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  12. dev_masta

    dev_masta Registered Member

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    PRO

    Why ?
    I suffer from BAP and let me tell you, there is no better medicine than THC.
    All the pills the doctors gave me made me half a person I really am, slow, drooling, could easily say - retarded.
    Only when I smoke marijuana, I feel "normal", hey, at least I am able to speak normally.
    I am able to function 100%, learn, laugh, socialize, no tremendous ups and downs.

    Please make it legal in my country, I don't want to have problems with the law only because I want to feel better!
     
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  13. Kickflip

    Kickflip BANNED BANNED

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    I live in BC, Canada so Marijuana use is very common here even in public places. It is decriminalized so you can't get arrested for smoking it in public.

    Cons:
    Marijuana smells bad. Whenever I smell it, I want to vomit.

    Many people who I interact with when they are under the influence of Marijuana react bizarrely to simple situations. They seem to not care about consequences of their actions as much, similarly to when someone is drunk. This worries me of course because they may make decisions which could have severe effects on themselves and others around them.

    Some people sell drugs for a living. This is their profession. People believe simply if you make Marijuana sales legally available, then people will stop being criminals. This is wishful thinking, and I doubt it is a realistic scenario. If Marijuana is no longer a lucrative businesses for Drug Dealers, they may move on to pushing other substances.

    My friends smoke so much marijuana, that they do not get the same high from it anymore, so they have had to move on to other drugs in order to get a decent feeling. I feel this would be a much more common scenario if Marijuana use is treated as a normal habit.

    My friends who smoke marijuana can't stop coughing and choking all of the time. They sound like they have chronic bronchitis and I am sure this will have long term effects on their overall health.

    Many people who I know who smoke marijuana try to force others to do it also even against their own will. I have had this happen several times to me, and even been threatened with violence if I didn't do it. I feel that people will try to convince others to smoke it even more if it becomes legally available because they will use the legalization as an excuse.

    I have smoked marijuana 3 times in life all against my will (as noted, threats of violence and other situations which are difficult to explain). I didn't get any positive effect from it. My lungs burned very badly and I smelled horrible. It was a very negative experience.
     
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  14. GreyWolf

    GreyWolf Executive VIP Jr. VIP

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    Two things about that.

    One, what you're describing is recreational use. There's a difference between getting blazed all the time and just using it to feel better.

    Second, You really recommend getting drunk on weekends instead because you 'wont degenerate into a dumb laughing retard..'? Let me tell you, I know a lot of people that do exactly that. They get shitfaced drunk on the weekends and when they do they become idiots. Not only that but a lot of them get belligerent and get into fights as well. That's something a lot more common for someone that gets drunk than it is for someone that gets high.



    So, it definitely might be something you don't for yourself. But just because it didn't have a positive effect in your life or for someone you know, is that a reason to prohibit everyone from using it?

    That's exactly the argument that was used by prohibitionists regarding alcohol at the end of the 19th century, yet alcohol prohibition still turned out to be a failed policy.

    Just like anything else, it might be better for some people to stay away from it. But that doesn't justify a prohibition. There are things in which it is good to protect people from themselves, but cannabis use isn't one of them. Cannabis has too many positive uses, and can be used by most people as responsibly as alcohol is used. In fact it actually has many more benefits than alcohol does and much less negatives.

    I personally don't use marijuana very often and I never get blazed. I also don't drink very often and when I do I seldom get shitfaced. I typically only use enough to barely get high whether it's alcohol or marijuana. The experience you described for yourself is totally different than it is for me.

    If you don't want to use it for yourself, I totally respect your right to not use it. I would never try to force it on you. I also think that just because you don't like it yourself, I wouldn't want you to decide for me whether I can use it or not. So it appalls me that our government chooses to deny me the use of a natural substance, with the justification it can cause problems for some people that might use it. Especially since they do allow other things that can cause similar and in some cases even worse problems.
     
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  15. antsaoo

    antsaoo Supreme Member

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    I don't understand why everyone most of the time just speak of smoking weed if it gets legalized.

    Ofcource is good medicine for many things. But also you can use it for bio diesel(maybe other gas stuff) better than the oil palms, good fibers for paper and clothing. We can also Burn it for energy. Also the seeds are really good for eating. Weed is good for the land and also can handle lots of co2 + Grows lots faster than trees.


    This is business forum for fuck sake :D

    ps. i don't smoke weed, its boring as fuck. i like mushooms <3
     
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  16. joaquin112

    joaquin112 Regular Member

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    Well this is definitely a complicated issue with a lot of opposing views. I'm all for freedom and letting people do whatever they want as long as they don't harm others. Make marijuana legal, but just like cigarettes ban it in public places, etc... That's just what I think anyway.
     
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  17. madoctopus

    madoctopus Supreme Member

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    @GreyWolf - Let's not forget Big Pharma and The Church who both have high stakes in keeping Marijuana illegal. And other interesting drugs too (Salvinorin A, DMT).

    Thing is pretty much every medicine has a lethal dose. 5000 people die every year from Aspirin (to some people it burns through the stomach membrane, being an acid). Marijuana has no lethal dose. No matter how much you consume you don't die. Coffee, alcohol, nicotine, aspirin, etc. all have a lethal dose.

    The reason I think ALL SUBSTANCES should be legal is because I think it is my right not to be denied anything. You can inform people of the bad effects of a substance but you have no right to deny them a substance. Think about it - Sulfuric Acid is legal right? If you put a drop on your skin it will burn through it. Rat poison is legal, mosquito sprays are legal. Nobody inhales those, right? It's just dumb to deny access to something with the excuse "it's for your own good". Who the fuck are you to decide that for me?!

    You used to consume drugs and fucked up your life? Let me tell you something. The drugs didn't fucked up your life. YOU DID! With or without drugs you would have still managed to screw yourself up. It's because you're frickin' weak and don't think. Don't blame a substance when it was YOU who took the decision to consume it. It's like saying electricity is bad and we shouldn't use it because you put a nail in the wall socket and electrocuted yourself. Seriously, accept responsibility and stop blaming others or situations. I hear many people saying that they smoked Marihuana and got dumb. Well, for some people it has that effect. There are others who smoked it every day for 40 years and didn't got dumber. There are some people who won the Nobel Prize because of stuff they discovered while high on Marihuana. They even admitted they would have probably never discovered those things if not high. Smoke it - you don't feel good from it, stop. It's simple, isn't it?

    That being said there are kids who get in shit and end up with personal tragedies, in juvenile detention or in jail because they are caught with Marihuana. You think that's normal or constructive? People get drunk and start fights, pay a fine and everybody forgets. You are caught with pot on yourself and even though you did no harm you will live for the rest of your life with that "badge".

    Then again, most people are just plain thick. It amuses me when they complain their lives suck. Guess why that is? Because you're thick and prefer to believe whatever you're fed with because it's easier, instead of chasing the truth. Thumbs up to GreyWolf for actually doing research on the subject. Maybe you give us some links to learn more. I'm always hungry for facts.
     
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  18. jazzc

    jazzc Moderator Staff Member Moderator Jr. VIP

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    No government can do that in the real world ;)

    When something is wanted by many (good or bad regardless), governments are unable to enforce a law, for the simple reason that governments are based on people and people are by nature corrupt(able).

    That is why control is better than prohibition. People are much more likely to support control and thus make the government 's regulations successful.
     
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  19. jazzc

    jazzc Moderator Staff Member Moderator Jr. VIP

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    You forget the laws of supply and demand. If 100 people want and illegal product A and 10 people want an illegal product B, there are say 10 vendors for A and 1 vendor for B.

    Legalizing A, will not cause demand for product B to rise, thus there will still be viable supply of 1 vendor. The rest will either go legal business (=tax) or go out of business.
     
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  20. jazzc

    jazzc Moderator Staff Member Moderator Jr. VIP

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    You can even get poisoned by too much water! (dilutes the blood).

    That 's full of win :)

    To many men want a daddy. Now, that would not be bad in the case of cute blond chicks :D , but for guys? People need to grow some balls and accept responsibility.

    Win again :)
     
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