Sorry but I am siding with MaxBounty & Steve on this one.

Based on the evidence provided it sounds like the OP was filling offers himself in which case he deserves a ban. Same IP blocks = proxies.

He did a shitty job covering his tracks and he got angry when he was 1 UP'ed by MB. That is the game gentlemen, when you get outplayed don't complain, come back better and fix your errors.

This is really part of the game. Thats why you don't put your eggs in one basket (this is for the noobs)

So as you can see even big companies like Go0gle will cheat you out. So the lesson here to those who are new in IM is that when your earning a decent amount of $$ from one network move to the next one and so on a so forth. The reason is that when things gets shaky you dont starve and become homeless

Actually, I didn't fill in a single ad of my own.... So yeah, wrong guess there Mr.E. Just letting you know.

Originally Posted by MrE

Sorry but I am siding with MaxBounty & Steve on this one.

Based on the evidence provided it sounds like the OP was filling offers himself in which case he deserves a ban. He did a shitty job covering his tracks and he got angry when he was 1 UP'ed by MB.

That is the game gentlemen, when you get outplayed don't complain, come back better and fix your errors.

Let's assume that Jason an Amanda are filling up the surveys themselves .
Now why didn't they got banned from the beginning . Maxbounty TOS clearly state that Fraud is not allowed and Fraud=Ban .
Plus, even if their leads are fraudulent , does that explain why MaxSteve is insulting Chinese and Asian people .
And for your info SteveMax , Jason and Amanda are from Texas , I talked with Jason on Skype and he is an American with a Texan accent
And if you can clear how you did check their accounts ( Amanda Account) , I will call you SuperMAn lol . I mean stating that they real name can not be Jason and Amanda , and Amanda is saying that the account is hers . There is only two options here :
Either , Amanda is lying which I REALLY doubt .
Or , SteveMax you are some super mind blowing person to check someone's account without knowing his real name or email address .
And if you did check her account , I guess you saw that the name in their is AMANDA , which lead us back to you lying and we can add that on your beautiful statement of '' we don't shave leads'' .
Bottom line : You guys just lost your reputation in here and by '' in here'' I mean the biggest place where Netpreneurs and business men meet and make things happen .
D4l1t0s

very interesting, Maxbounty in shit list ! i am sure a fair share of revenue comes from bhw.

I appreciate the fact that maxsteve came to defend and clarify OPs statement.
That being said i didn't like the way steve spoke out here. Just coz the OP started this thread you banned him from your network , why ? so if he had not put his thread and kept going probably he could have continued with what he was doing and you would continue the shave.


The facts steve said might be right but i dont agree you banning him just coz he started this discussion.

PS: i like Chinese food, am i eligible to join your network .

He was probably banned when Steve took a closer look at his account, leads, and referring sites. OP brought this attention upon himself.

I was banned because I started this thread. Steve didn't take a closer look at my account until I started this thread because frankly he did not care what we're doing as long as we were complaining about shaving. I had no intention of ever using his network again after I put this thread up. He didn't like the idea that somebody was checking him and finding out what he was doing. I don't care that he banned me, I knew the consequences of calling out someone in his position. And if anybody else was to rip me off I would post here because that's what you do when somebody is not doing the right thing. There's a reason my name is not on the shit list. Because I do business straightforwardly. I did this as a warning for all to read. If people want to be part of his network more power to them. I just know what he did to me.let this be a warning to all: you saw what he did, he attacked me personally before he attacked me professionally. He spoke in racist terms which I hope everyone finds offensive. That shows more about his personality than anything else. I still have not had the answer to this question"if I was fraudulent why was I not banned?"
Jason and Amanda

Originally Posted by MrE

He was probably banned when Steve took a closer look at his account, leads, and referring sites. OP brought this attention upon himself.

I've got a few points to make here, so I'll take them one at a time.

First off, I'm man enough to admit when I make a mistake and I certainly do admit that I made a mistake when I tried comparing the OP to someone who is Chinese. While I deal with Chinese people impersonating Americans on a daily basis (just to get into MaxBounty), it was unfair and out of line for me to draw such a conclusion here. I sincerely apologize to anyone who I may have offended with that statement.

Secondly, I stand behind the ban of the OP. I've seen a significant amount of fraud over the 7 years I've been running MaxBounty. More than you can possibly imagine. The traffic provided by the OP fits the classic case of an affiliate self-generating/incentivizing leads and trying to mask it with bulk traffic. This has been happening for years and I've seen it being done at least 100 times. This method has been talked about here on BHW before, so it really shouldn't be news to anyone.

Thirdly, the OP's account was banned because he brought attention to himself by slagging us publically, which led to the investigation to his account. Should this really surprise anyone? The opening statement here wasn't a civil request for me to look into a problem. He was calling us out in an antagonistic way. Anyone who knows my history on this (and other) forums should realize that if you are going to challenge me like that, I'm going to stand up for my company. Why didn't I look sooner? Because the OP started his traffic in late January and had been running under the radar. The whole point of running under the radar is to avoid detection. Drawing attention to yourself is somewhat counterproductive.

Lastly, this is BHW. Everyone here knows that *some* of you are generating leads of dubious quality that are violating network T&C's. *Some* of you are stealing people's info, some of you are using bots, some of you are using iframing tools, some of you are filling out leads yourselves and some of you are invalidly incenting campaigns. Those of you who choose to do that have to realize that at some point you might get caught and you really shouldn't be that surprised when you are booted from networks. As I've read many posters here: "it's part of the game".

UGH, Get it straight.. Since you banned me, you should know that im a she... Would you like a pic for proof.... Yes, this is Jason's profile, but look, it's Amanda.... Im pissed at how you blame me for getting banned when I out the shaving...

Yes, we did call you out, and whatever, you are mad or such, but I still made you more money than you have ever paid me... I know that I have been owed considerably more than what was paid to me in my length as a MaxBounty member, and since you got a bad review, you banned me.. But that's just fine.. I have plenty of other CPA companies to use, I didn't really need yours.

Thanks again,

Amanda

Originally Posted by dizzspaceteam

okay guys from Max bounty I and didn't ask you to pay me back but I did ask one question. If I was fraud why was I not banned? I think this is the most important question when you accuse somebody of fraud. You can say anything you like about us that's fine. But if we were fraudulent then the question to bear once again is" why were we not banned"?
Jason and Amanda

If he didn't ban you now you would have been banned by the end of the month. I lost $2,000 with MaxBounty. What's funny is they waited until the LAST moment before banning my account. Suspicious, no?

MaxSteve, attacking DizzSpaceTeam on a personal level was just low.

But there are plenty of other networks out there, don't sweat it.

hi silencer for a long time since I talk you. It's Jason now. Yeah that is his MO banning upon due payment. Amanda has plenty of other networks that are reputable and that we will throw lots of traffic at. It's just funny that this was a white hat thing. He's just pissed off because I put a check on them. Being able to have someone build your custom software is a great thing.

MaxSteve, or MaxThat, Or someone from Maxbounty team.
You said you are such a great network, we are in top 5 bla bla bla bla..
Ok let´s get to the point now.

You say you are the best, and you´re not shaving, etc etc.

Then post the proof that you´re not shaving as you were stated in the other post you were made in this thread. Isn´t that fair for us to know.

Originally Posted by MaxSteve

For the rest of you reading this note carefully that MaxBounty never has, and never will shave leads.

JAJAJAJAJAJAJJAAJAJAJAJ



..and no, I'm not mexican.

I notice Steven, that you did not speak of advertiser complaints. It is very easy to ask, and if that is not a consideration here then you have no place to assume fraud. If you are making base accusations according to the vagaries and inconsistency of circumstantial evidence, if it even qualifies as that, you are opening yourself up to questions of trust and loyalty. Banning her is inappropriate, and I make a demand that I do not want you to mistake for negotiable. You A., deliver proof of the fraud in the form of advertiser complaints to a trusted admin here, and we can close this flamewar with a matter resolved post that preserves privacy, or B., pay Amanda her money and recant the accusation. Failure to comply will result in a request for a ban for you as I will gather blackhat members to petition for such. I can also promise you, you can expect more well trafficked "Max Bounty Sucks" fan pages than you can dream of, and trust me, the talent here has way more ability than just that. So from this point I ask you to choose your words carefully, and make your decisions judiciously.

Amanda, at one point or another we have been accused or screwed over. This post may result in something positive, or not, but I encourage you to play cards closer to the vest next time. There are risks for your situation, as I have found having been in the business myself these networks stick together like we do. Also consider that if you have quality traffic, you can find much better options for you to utilize it. I hope that this post finds you in peace and having learned a valuable lesson about who to do business with.

Steven, consider this not personal, but cumulative. Ever increasing boorish and fraudulent behavior among the various networks are ruining the industry as much if not more than affiliate fraud, and the entire business model is on the verge of collapse. (Yes lowly affiliates go to Vegas conventions too.) You and I both know that a 36 percent conversion rate would have triggered a manual review, yet you claim that you looked into it upon the posting of this thread. Highly unlikely. There is an easy way to stop nearly all fraud, and I am surprised nobody has figured it out yet. Does this look familiar? "Shave? No. Filter out leads that fail their in-house fraud/dup/validity checks? " If email submit advertisers could do that, what would they need you for? The game is getting old and the valuable capital you built is rapidly being spent.

Finally, beings that you are so concerned, Steven, with the English language, see how this grabs you: if you are so up and up, and worried about fraud, what the FUCK are you doing here? You know full well that blackhatters are useful, because they get you paid. For every blackhatter you toss under the bus, another survives to fatten your wallet. You know that the people here, however they pull the lead, are more valuable than the idiots at digital point who are flailing trying to figure out motherfucking Adwords. So save the act.
We CPA participants are all lodgers in the Den of Inequity. Stop acting like you live on the hill.

Originally Posted by mudbutt

JAJAJAJAJAJAJJAAJAJAJAJ



..and no, I'm not mexican.

looool ;

Max Bounty is beyond horrible. They were one of the first CPA networks I was with when I first started. They definitely shave. Everyone brings up good points here, especially with how Steve chose to ban them AFTER this thread was posted, when if the conversion rate is so high, the traffic would have definitely been manually reviewed. When I was with them, I got tons of less clicks and close to zero converts, and the minute I switched over to another CPA network, I got at least 3x more clicks. Regardless, if you know they are shaving, just switch over to a different network. Never keep your eggs in one basket.

I agree with No1here your post was highly offensive. Not only to those that may be Asian/Chinese, but also to those that may not speak or write perfect English. I don't have an account with Max Bounty, and after reading this thread I can guarantee that I will not be opening one in the future. And for the record shaving is unethical and at some level it should be an illegal act. If it is true that this practice is going on within the CPA industry, then maybe the Justice Dept should look into these shady Network practices. To me it is stealing from the affiliate plain and simple.

Just my two cents....

I agree with No1here your post was highly offensive. Not only to those that may be Asian/Chinese, but also to those that may not speak or write perfect English. I don't have an account with Max Bounty, and after reading this thread I can guarantee that I will not be opening one in the future. And for the record shaving is unethical and at some level it should be an illegal act. If it is true that this practice is going on within the CPA industry, then maybe the Justice Dept should look into these shady Network practices. To me it is stealing from the affiliate plain and simple.

Just my two cents....

Oh my god, some of you guys are whingers. they used the same set of ips to fill out high paying offers (this was they super dooper way of testing the system), anyone with half a brain can tell that it was fake signups.
They got caught cheating the system, stop crying about it and move on. don't you guys have anything better to do than whinge about getting caught cheating?

Oh, and I don't have an account with max bounty, this is purely my observation.

since obviously you didn't read the post in your believing the Kool-Aid that Max is a serving the same set I keys were not used to fill out high-paying offers that is a straight out lie. Just want to correct you there Capt.we were not just testing the system we were testing Max bounty system we made it software to checkout how bad they were shaving so no high-paying offers were being filled out by the same IP. He has yet to offer up proof of this. If there was proof he would land out here so I would be banned. We were setting up a system of websites we were putting ads on them the sites were fully finished yet they were getting traffic so some people were filling out ads. He's mad because he got caught. So Capt. next time you speak please read what the OP which is me and Amanda write because it's not in Chinese. And he still hasn't answered the one question I keep asking if it was fraud or you were thinking we were fraudulent why did you not ban us until we posted this thread?

Originally Posted by The Captain

Oh my god, some of you guys are whingers. they used the same set of ips to fill out high paying offers (this was they super dooper way of testing the system), anyone with half a brain can tell that it was fake signups.
They got caught cheating the system, stop crying about it and move on. don't you guys have anything better to do than whinge about getting caught cheating?

Oh, and I don't have an account with max bounty, this is purely my observation.

Originally Posted by dizzspaceteam

since obviously you didn't read the post in your believing the Kool-Aid that Max is a serving the same set I keys were not used to fill out high-paying offers that is a straight out lie.

If you are so innocent, why did you tell him to check the ips of the local libraries and you bet the signups came from there? How would you know where the signups came from if you didn't do them yourself?

He's mad because he got caught.

looks more like *you* are mad because you got caught.

And he still hasn't answered the one question I keep asking if it was fraud or you were thinking we were fraudulent why did you not ban us until we posted this thread?

maybe you should do what you told me to do and READ. he already stated that you got caught because you brought attention to yourself, until then you were flying under the radar. Most companies will either scrap the bad submits or let a few bad ones go through, but start sending a shitload of crap leads and you are going to get banned.
You say you are redneck, but surely even a redneck is smart enough to see that?

Originally Posted by mudbutt

I notice your post contains many spelling errors...are you Chinese?

oh really? kindly point them out

I never said the sign ups came from public ips and he has not said that either.I know how I promote my sites.You are misinformed.The spelling they are referring to is "whingers".I did not get caught at anything He said that I was under the radar.And once again I ask "this is for you capt" if I was fraud why did he not ban me.....the answer is because it was never fraud.He can say it but he does offer no proof.I said what I did to check him.So capt.you are speaking without true understanding.
Dizz

Originally Posted by dizzspaceteam

I never said the sign ups came from public ips and he has not said that either.I know how I promote my sites.You are misinformed.The spelling they are referring to is "whingers".I did not get caught at anything He said that I was under the radar.And once again I ask "this is for you capt" if I was fraud why did he not ban me.....the answer is because it was never fraud.He can say it but he does offer no proof.I said what I did to check him.So capt.you are speaking without true understanding.
Dizz

hey dizz, remember the captain guy from the giveaway. its him.

Originally Posted by dizzspaceteam

I never said the sign ups came from public ips

it sure looked like you did. here, let me show you:

Originally Posted by dizzspaceteam

How many of those distinct IP's are public libraries or something like that? I bet if we checked that's what they are

The spelling they are referring to is "whingers".

maybe they also don't understand English: http://www.thefreedictionary.com/whingers

I did not get caught at anything He said that I was under the radar.

flying under the radar means you were doing wrong but just haven't been caught yet. this thread allowed you to be caught. You do understand that concept, right?

And once again I ask "this is for you capt" if I was fraud why did he not ban me.....the answer is

The answer is "he did ban you". oh, and I doubt he needs to show proof.

honestly, whinging about a few email submits. Is money really that hard to make?

Originally Posted by haridada

hey dizz, remember the captain guy from the giveaway. its him.

yeah I'm the guy that thought it was lame to give away a single account with nothing in it... your point?

oh I get it, you were giving away single accounts to boost your rep, you wouldn't get as much rep giving away more accounts to less people. i guess it's all part of the scam.

no I totally forgot that. It totally slipped my mind that the captain was a guy who was complaining about me giving away twitter accounts. So he's over here complaining about something that he knows nothing about because I blew him off when he made a smartass comment on a giveaway thread. Thanks I forgot totally.

Look on another note folks this thread needs to get closed first of all Max Steve will never admit to any wrongdoing. I didn't do any fraud and that is my stance. He can falsify or make up whatever information at this point he wants. I never did asking for the money back because he's never to give it back. I put this up here so all people could see that they are a company that should not be worked with that is my opinion. Now I know about 90% of the thread shell on my side. Thank you very much for the people that cited with me. Steve this is the second time your company has done this to me that's why came at you the way I did. You were never intended to make it right if I ask you to. You know I'm not guilty of fraud or you would've banned me the first second that you got wind of it. Over 6000 clicks went to my account and you talk about geo-targeted what ever blah blah blah. I don't care I was never that he used your company again. There was only $10 left in that account and you know what I think you should put it. I want this to be over. The damages been done to both of us. I lost money that you owed me. You've lost affiliates. I don't accept your apology for your racist comment . Maybe the rest of them will buy your happier hand routine. I was stinking mad when I wrote this. But I didn't attack you personally I attacked your company. You attacked me personally you made it racial and personal. And then you went on to say fraud this fraud that an attacking professionally. There was no advertiser complaints your account managers would've contacted Amanda unless they never got complaints. If you would like to take care of this personally with me or Amanda UK the PM doesn't ask us what the problem was after I posted this but you turned it personal. It was very unprofessional I think. I'll do fraud I sometimes do black Hat sometimes gray hat sometimes white hat but never do fraud. At this point you can have written up any kind of complaints you want but if you produce a complaint from an advertiser please produce that advertisers contact information to a moderator so they can verify it. I don't think you're in a come up with much. But personally I just want this thread to be over with not because I'm guilty of anything wrong because I'm not. I'm just sick of the time it's taking out of my life when I should be working in making money. You're in the top five that's great I wonder how long you stay there treating your affiliates like this. I love my job working and IM and we use lots of other affiliates that we have no problems with. So good luck to you in your company and I do mean that I hope you saved your money. We work in a world where reputation is everything and I have a reputation for not lying. But your reputation is a little less than honest. You burn me before you burn me again I will never let you have that chance every again. So insulting that you had to stoop to the level of insulting me personally it is in embarrassing. What kind of person are you personally I really have to wonder after that statement. I know you apologized any good businessman would want to retract that statement especially after with the way the crowd reacted to it. But in my experience as a person and as a businessman usually the first statements and words that come out of a person mouth is really who he is and how he feels. I hope that you change and I hope that you change or business practices. You banning us was a joke it's kind of like firing the guy who just quit. You can keep treating your affiliates this way. The ones that are joining you will find out the hard way the ones you've read this thread won't join you and the ones who are using you might stop using you. You know I wasn't defrauding you and you aren't getting any complaints from the advertisers.

Jason and Amanda

Originally Posted by haridada

hey dizz, remember the captain guy from the giveaway. its him.

luv it when someone calls other company scammer, and company staff joins the forum XD